Archive for the ‘Simplistic Theist Minds’ Category

This argument is simply that without an imaginary friend I can’t know right from wrong, good from bad or terrific from terrible (maybe even if I had a dictionary at hand). That without an imaginary friend I should murder, rape and be generally unpleasant, always.

There two major variations on this and as this article is only a short statement I will try to use only two. Just so we know the score, I will argue the case of the christian imaginary friend because of its prominence in my society, but note, a similar line of arguement can be used for all beliefs.

The first angle on this argument assumes your imaginary friend is 1) real, and 2) that your special friend has good rules that anyone can follow and be good by. Part 1), your god is not real. Thank you for your patience with that part of this argument. I hope it wasn’t too wordy for you to come to terms with its meaning. Lets move on. Part 2), what is it the christian gods representative book says about being good? With over 300 dictates from this god listed in the book its hard to go through them all in a short statement and lets face it christians don’t know them or obey them anyway. I will focus on the top 10 “commandments” as thy are called because christians at least claim to follow those dictates. In the top 10 there is a lot of praising, almost half of them, I don’t see how that instructs us on our lives and is surely a little egotistical for a supreme being. I also see plenty of christians praising the god of capitalism (wealth) and communism (state). We have don’t covert, murder or consider another god (I thought there was only meant to be one) directed specifically at our behaviour not a bad start if we ditch the praising but in being so rigid it some of these very few rules becomes dangerous in themselves. The big question however is, what happened to some of the basics. Don’t rape because its a fucking shitty thing to do, all people are equal because god doesn’t have favorite’s, be good to the environment its the only one your getting and didn’t you read the opening chapter where it says I “liked it” or even something as simple as don’t be an arsehole. No I’m sorry your imaginary god has not given you a good moral code to live by, even in the top 10, and if you tried to live by the other 300 “commandments” you would be locked away and maybe classified as insane.

The second argument is more personal and in fact quite rude. It assumes that I should be doing quite terrible things, always. This is a concern to many atheists and if you about to give up believing in any god to go and do something horrible I implore you to continue believing. Statistical evidence of prison populations could be given here showing atheists represent a smaller percentage of the population than their equivalent number in the general population, but, I don’t know if that is accurate. Given the unwarranted respect religion is given in showing a person have reformed it may be, though it seems not, that there are many converts-of-convenience in prisons. Because I will not rely on statistics I will put myself and my atheist family on the table for discussion. I have never raped, murdered or been in prison (I may be generally unpleasant but who needs to make everyone happy). Maybe I’m letting down the side but should that even be possible. Over my entire 45+ years of life I have never prayed to nor believed there was a god. I am also charitable but not to big money organisations. I have and will again invite total strangers in need into my home and treat them as family until they get their problems sorted. My life partners equally, maybe even more so, are good law abiding sorts and life long atheists who have never done time in prison. My eldest son is 18 and I haven’t had one visit from the police due to his behaviour in that time, I almost wish he would get out and do something adventurous. That makes the current count 4 of 4, 6 of 6 if you include my parents, 9 of 9 if you include all of our living atheist parents, that qualify as good people by our societies standards. The other thing you assume is that we can’t understand or obey laws, the laws that are an extension of our developing social moral standards and far more involved than your bible is in directing good behaviour (and mostly without praising) and punishing bad behaviour (more humanely than your bible).

Your nonexistent god seems unable to cover the basics very well and we atheists are simply not doing our part in supporting your stupid claims of low behavioural standards. If it simply comes down to your measure of morality being an imaginary friend, I have to tell you your standards are too low and childish for me.

My your gods remain fictional,

The Antitheocrat.

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This argument goes quite simply “do you know your great (great great great) grandmother existed?”. Yes it is that simplistic.

Let’s start at the top. I am here and alive. I may not know who my great grandmother was but I can most definitely assume someone birthed my grandmother, mother and in turn, me from my experiences and knowledge. I saw both my sons being born so I know what vaginas are capable of. I know well enough that I sprang forth from my mother loins to assume my grandmother and my great grandmother had similar biological abilities. Finally I know there is a family history going back 400 years on my mothers side so I can assume 800, 1,600 and even more are entirely possible and likely. Given I am here as a product of being born of another person why would I have need to consider magic was used?

It isn’t always easy to know which direction the person asking is going but this is normally an argument for creationism and less often an argument for a historical jesus.

On the creationist side they have to be making some very big assumptions about how historical evidence came about beyond their 6,000 to 10,000 year planet birth. Assumptions they don’t make about the evidence from the 6,000 to 10,000 years since planet birth. If tomorrow they could find something that carbon dated as being around the time of Noah and everything pointed to it being a boat with kangaroo shit in it, they would yell it from roof tops that carbon dating proved them right. It doesn’t matter if I don’t know who my great grandmother was, I have enough evidence of her existence being a possibility to assume with confidence that she in fact existed. Our planet popping into existence from nothing is not in any way as acceptable as my great grandmother based on the evidence at hand. Assuming a god and a planet popping into existence along with life simply doesn’t offer anything but guessing and story telling. Science has not once found the answers to our existence in the bible, much study and hard work was done so other people could later try to find things in the bible that sounded similar. Though I may not know or understand all science I do know people are finding answers, questions and more answers that give us real information. Telling me I was not there to see the dinosaurs or know my Grandmothers mother and guessing an alternative to what can actually be proven is shear stupidity.

The person making an argument for a historical jesus is a little strange unless they are trying to say they have documented and DNA evidence of direct linage from jesus to show he existed. I have not heard this argument often but i have heard it made this way. The thing is I most certainly must have direct linage to my great grandmother whoever she was. Even if we assume someone in my linage was adopted and my great grandmother is not who I think she is, I still have one, everyone alive today has one. Some of may even have even met our great grandmother. On the other hand there is no historical record of jesus, the name jesus in the middle East at that time or any miraculous event attributed to anybody named jesus. Attributing any other name, especially a common jewish name only clouds the issue further. The only evidence normally given for jesus is a fictional book full of supernatural fairy folk and historical inaccuracy. I for one will not assume jesus as being as possible as my great grandmother, I may as well assume hobbits exist.

In conclusion. If you are going to try this argument on me, I am going to look at you and treat you like the idiot you present yourself as.

May you gods remain fictional,

The Antitheocrat.